Murdoch and Wilde

[Martin Lambert]

Hi all new here and I have a few questions hopefully people can help

1)Other then the fatal full asteern order Murdoch gave that aside could he have done something to save the ship,prehaps hard to port instead?...

2)What was Cheif Officer wilde's duties on the ship and what did he do on the evening of the sinking as there seems to be lil knowledge of him

3)is the theroy of Murdoch turning to port because he saw haz infront of him so he made a course change before the fatal berg was seen?
While I don't belive this my self there seems to be a case seeing how as how fleet said before the berg was in sight titanic made a turn to port plus it is said that the lookouts spotted a haze at 11:30 and then again at 11:40,was that haze off to the port thus why they didnt call it in but after the appernt course change a haze reappeard?

 

[Michael H. Standart]

What fatal astern order?

i know it's well engrained in the mythos but the problems here are two fold:

1)While such an order may have been given, the evidence that it was actually carried out before the collision is very suspect.

2) In point of fact, per evidence given by two survivors (Dillon and Scott) from the engine room, engine reversal didn't happen until after the accident.

If they're right, it kind of throws a monkey wrench into the conventional theory.

As to how the collision could have been prevented, the surest way of accomplishing that would have been to steer well clear of the region of ice in the first place. You can't have a collision of you're not cruising where the roadblocks are. As it was, they were and by the time the danger was spotted and understood for what it was, it was already too late.

 

[Steve Shortman]

“…Chief Officer Wilde…what did he do on the evening…”

I believe Wilde spent the majority of his time on the bridge acting as the Captain’s ‘right hand man’. 2nd Officer Lightoller oversaw the work on the port side whilst 1st Officer Murdoch did likewise on Starboard with the pair popping out from the bridge at intervals to see how things were progressing. For example according to the Wormstedt/Fitch/Behe lifeboat launching sequence they were both seen at the same time/vicinity (#8 at approx 1.00 and #2 at approx 1.45) indicating that they were periodically assessing the situation ‘together’.

My thinking is that Smith would have had a number of people (Officers, Chief engineers, Carpenters, Andrews, Phillips etc etc) regularly reporting and updating him on the situation and he needed to be in a place where he could be found, ie. the bridge. (Lightoller displayed similar thinking post collision when he remained in his quarters where he knew he could be found if required).

Simultaneously the Captain would have needed one of his senior officers at hand to carry out his orders and too communicate with other key players not to mention having someone that he could bounce his worried thoughts off of.

The fact that they spent a lot of time on the bridge hidden from view may explain why not a lot was seen of the pair during this critical period.

 

[Samuel Halpern]

The entire haze story was a fabrication that first came up at British inquiry by lookout Lee trying to give an excuse why the berg was not spotted earlier. Fleet, for reason's unknown, decided to back him up by saying some haze was there but did not restrict their view at all. There were major inconsistencies between their accounts. When Lightoller discussed what happened with Fleet on the Carpathia, haze was never brought up. Lightoller said there was no haze while he was OOW until 10 pm. Even after the collision, nobody saw any haze from the deck of the ship or from the lifeboats. There was no haze seen from the Carpathia or any other ship in the vicinity that night. The water and air temperatures were such that haze would not have formed in the first place. (See Shackleton's testimony.) Some have postulated that what was seen was ice blink, but that was not possible because the sky was cloudless. The ship was too far (2-3 miles) from the field ice for that to have been seen by reflected starlight. Even Rostron didn't notice the great ice field to the west until after the sun came up.

As far as Wilde's duties, as C/O he was the executive officer of the ship who held joint responsibility with the commander for the safe navigation of the ship. Responsibilities included personal inspection of all the lifeboats, standing regular watch as OOW twice a day, performing an evening inspection at 8 pm, keeping the ship's log, etc.

 

[Martin Lambert]

So is it possible for wilde to intercept and slow the ship down and adjust the course just like Smith could at any time?

Thanks for the Answers guys,another thing is it possible if someone could tell me how the watches ran on the bridge what time each officer was in charge

 

[Samuel Halpern]

>>>So is it possible for wilde to intercept and slow the ship down and adjust the course just like Smith could at any time?<<<

In an emergency situation any of the three senior officers could do that.

Think of the C/O as the next in line should something happen to the commander.

The watch schedule for the senior officers is described below:

13443. Just give me, if you will, the arrangement about the watches between the Chief Officer, the First Officer, and yourself [2/O Lightoller]. I suppose you would count as the three Senior Officers? - Yes, exactly.

13444. How was that? - The Chief Officer had from 2 until 6 a.m. and p.m.; the Second Officer -

13445. That is you? - Yes, myself. The Second Officer relieved the Chief at 6 o'clock and was on deck until 10 - 6 to 10 a.m., and p.m.. The First Officer was on deck from 10 to 2 a.m. and p.m.

 

[David G. Brown]

I agree with Sam there was no haze on the night of the accident. The lookouts did not see anything remotely resembling meteorological haze.

Mental haze? Well, that's another story.

-- David G. Brown