Yes. I fully believe what @Samuel Halpern said about the break-up in his "why the low angle break?" chapter and the graph in his book clearly illustrates that the stresses on the keel were maximum when the rising stern reached an angle of 12-degrees. The actual break-up must have started at that point, but it would have taken several minutes for the structural failure to progress to the extent that the keel and deck plates ripped apart. During that time, the bow would have continued to dip rather rapidly with the result that even with the strucural integrity failing, the stern would have continued to rise. IMO, the visible final break-up of the Titanic, as reported by many survivors, occurred between 02:18 and 02:19 am with the stern by then at around 25 degrees.At 2:16 AM, the Titanic had reached a low angle, likely around 12 degrees, and the structural integrity of the ship was beginning to fail in earnest. At this point, the decks were becoming nearly impossible to stand on without clinging to something, and the stresses on the keel and the joints between the bow and stern sections were reaching their limits. The ship, which had already been groaning and creaking under the strain, must have been a cacophony of snapping metal, rushing water, and human panic. By 2:18 AM, this tension culminated in the final, catastrophic failure: the bow and stern sections of the ship separated, with the bow plunging downward into the depths and the stern momentarily lifting higher before it began its own descent.
I fully agree. One of the few things that I disagree with the view of certain experts (even though I accept most of their other analyses) is their impressions of the final plunge and break-up. Some believe that the final separation of the bow and the stern happened as early as 02:17am and the stern section then remained afloat for 3 to 4 minutes; I do not believe that myself. I accept the analysis by @Samuel Halpern on the break-up and agree with you that after the bow and stern separated, the latter reamined afloat for less than 90 seconds. But to observers from lifeboats nearby, those event-filled final catastrophic moments would have seemed considerably longer.It’s reasonable to conclude that after the separation, the stern section had less than 90 seconds afloat.
Absolutely true and a lot of people would have been thus caught between the proverbial Devil and the Deep Sea. They would have known that clinging to the breaking structure would have been almost hopeless for survival but at the same time, would have been too scared of jumping into the freezing water and the prospect of a difficult swim to a nearby lifeboat. For the many clinging to the stern, that fear would have got worse as the stern rose higher, making decisions even more difficult. In the final minute or two, many who fell or jumped could also have been injured, maybe badly, by the jagged broken structures of the ship of even debris in the water.Jumping into freezing water was a horrific prospect, but compared to staying aboard a sinking, tilting, and groaning structure on the verge of collapse, it might have seemed like the only option. The chaos and noise of the breakup likely drove many to make the desperate choice to jump into the frigid waters, as remaining aboard a sinking, splintering structure offered little hope of survival.
Which is what makes me wonder about Chief Baker Joughin's survival story. Of course, I have never believed most of it since I knew that things like "swimming for hours" were impossible, but in the past I felt that there could have been elements of truth in how he hung on at the stern as it descended into its final plunge. But conisdering that after the break-up the separated stern section was rising and swinging as it flooded rapidly, hanging on at the very end would have been almost impossible. Therefore I wonder if Joughin, who had probably gone to the pantry for a glass of water just before the break-up, simply jumped into the sea from some point just aft of the flooding bridge on the port side and swam away as the Titanic sank. That way he would not have been far from the overturned Collapsible B on top of which he was helped on to by cook Maynard and probably a couple of others. Later he made-up a fantastic story about hanging on to the very end of the stern section as it sank, letting go just as he reached the water.I'm not sure how many were on the stern after the breakup. But I suspect most who were either fell or were forced to make a desperation jump that was either too high up or there were parts of the ship that they would smack into mid jump. Also, with that many people jumping, chances were high that you'd land on them if you jumped.
That I find that hanging onto very end is quite believable over jumping into the blackness that awaited below. The surprise, if there was one, would be the lack of a significant suction that many in the boats were terrified of.Later he made-up a fantastic story about hanging on to the very end of the stern section as it sank, letting go just as he reached the water.
That I find that hanging onto very end is quite believable over jumping into the blackness that awaited below. The surprise, if there was one, would be the lack of a significant suction that many in the boats were terrified of.
Understood. I remembered that it has been mentioned before that with the stiff life vests of the day, jumping from a height wearing them could have caused serious injury, including a broken neck. I wonder if many who jumped or fell off the rising stern after the break-up did break their necks when they hit the water.
About Joughin, I wondered if he simply went towards the sinking bow end and jumped when he was very close to the water just before the break-up or was washed overboard by the 'wave'; people like George Rheims, Peter Daly, Richard Williams, Carl Jansson, Jack Thayer etc might have survived in that manner.
Exactly. Despite this common knowledge that the "warmth" caused by alcohol is due to divertion of blood to the skin at the expense of vital organs like brain, heart and kidneys, you can still see nonsense on the web about how Joughin survived the freezing sea for 'several hours' because he was drunk. That kind of exposure while inebriated is certain to accelerate onset of stupor and unconciousness in the first place due to blood supply to the brain being compromised. With that, the person stops swimming or otherwise moving and even if he/she is wearing a life vest, fatal hypothermia will follow quickly.Alcohol is a vasodilator so it actually speeds up body heat loss. You may not care, but you freeze to death faster.
End of Joughin's story AFAIC.Either way, he swam to the nearby overturned Collapsible B and was hauled on board. That's all.