BackInTime1912
Member
Where the goodwins spend their last moments? Was it on the deck or were they somehow still trapped inside the ship?
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Goodwins seen on deck?
- Thread starter mary mason
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Ashley Lopez
Member
Does anyone know if Frederick Joseph Goodwin helped women and Children get into the lifeboats?
Arun Vajpey
Member
I am not sure if there is any report that anyone from the Goodwin family reached the boat deck. Fred Goodwin had a wife and 5 children and the boys were quite young. Therefore, if he was in a position to help anyone into lifeboats, I am sure that Fred Goodwin would have attended to his family first. The fact that none of them survived suggests that they either never reached tie boat deck or were part of that 'rush' that was seen in the last few minutes. By then it was too late for anyone to help someone else, or themselves for that matter.
I've read somewhere that the goodwins were on the deck, probably on the poop deck. The Titanic tilted completely and Augusta lost the grip of one of her daughters...
Thomas Krom
Member
According to two survivors who were on the poop deck during the final plunge, these being Trimmer Thomas Patrick Dillon (1879-1939) and Storekeeper Frank Winnold Prentice (1889-1982), only a handful of the people on-board made it to the poop deck during the final plunge. According to Dillon there were no women at all. Before the final plunge a mass of humanity came from the aft of the boat deck, most likely all of them coming up the forward second class staircase, after the exterior gates of the stairwells which led from the aft well deck to the B-deck second class promenade were either opened or that the crewmembers which guarded them stepped away. By the point of the final plunge most people were on the boat deck, including most women and children of third class.
Seumas
Member
You are probably thinking of August Wennerstrom trying to help Mrs Palsson with her children and losing his grip of the two children he was trying to hold onto as the ship's deck was too steep. This incident more than likely took place on the boat deck aft.
The whole image of the Titanic's stern crowded with over a thousand people when is a big myth. Dillon and Prentice who were actually there put it at only about fifty to a hundred people.
I don't think people today realise just how difficult it would have been to climb the sloping decks in common hobnail boots and shoes of the period.
Didn't this incident take place near collapsible boat A?? When the deck was almost going to be submerged by the water?..
Seumas
Member
If you can find Wennestrom's statement, please post it, and we'll have a second look at it but I've always been under the impression that they were on the boat deck either aft or midships and when deck became too steep, and they ended up losing their grip.
The actors, extras and stunt people that we are used to seeing in all the film and TV productions of the disaster keep their grip and balance far too easily. It would not have been like that on the actual night
I can't recall ever reading anything about the Goodwin's being on the boat deck.
Arun Vajpey
Member
While I cannot specifically recall a statement by Wennerstrom, the general impression that I got reading about that incident in various sources is that it happened somewhere near Collapsible A. Having said that, I'll have to check Wyn Craig Wade's book Titanic: The End of A Dream where there are a few quotes from Wennerstrom.
The other thing is that the 'wave' that caused Wennerstrom to lose his grip on those two kids would have pushed him also sternwards. If he had been amidships at the time, I doubt if he would have been one of the first to make it to Collapsible A after it tore free and started to drift away; from what I could gather from scattered accounts after the wave hit, Brown, Thompson, Wennerstrom and Abelseth managed to get into Collaspible A and hang on.
On a related note, scullion John Collins and an unidentified 'steward' were also in the vicinity, each hanging on to a child. It is difficult to be certain but it is possible that the kids were the other two of Alma Palsson's children and Alma herself might have been one of 4 or 5 women that Edward Brown saw struggling in the water near Collapsible A. Both Collins and the steward also lost their hold on the children when the wave hit and when Collins finally resurfaced, all the rest, including the steward were nowhere to be seen. Collins himself eventually made it to the overturned Collapsible B.
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Well I think you're right, August tried to hold the palsson children on deck but near collapsible A when water gushed in and he lost his grip on them...ki checked his bio on ET
Arun Vajpey
Member
I checked in WCW's book and indeed on pp313-4 of the paperback there is an account of how Wennerstrom got into Collapsible A. It is in third person and edited and so not easy to reconstruct, but the impression that I got was that Wennerstrom and the Lindells were near Collapsible A when the 'wave' initially pushed them sternward and then all three slid towards the now free and drifting lifeboat. Wennerstrom managed to get in and Edvard Lindell after a few minutes but Elin Lindell was unable to do so. Wennerstrom held onto her hands but did not have the strength to pull her in.
But it looks like that WCW has rather heavily edited Wennerstrom's account; first of all, there is no mention of the children that he was holding or of Alma Palsson hersel. Secondly, most other accounts suggest that only Wennerstrom managed to slide into Collapsible A as it drifted free; Those other sources, which include OASOG, indicate that the Lindells missed the boat and had to swim for several minutes to reach it. Edvard Lindell managed to (or was helped) to get on board but ws so cold and exhausted that he drifted into unconsciousness and soon died. Wennerstrom tried to help Elin Lindell but could not and she too soon drifted away to her death.
But it looks like that WCW has rather heavily edited Wennerstrom's account; first of all, there is no mention of the children that he was holding or of Alma Palsson hersel. Secondly, most other accounts suggest that only Wennerstrom managed to slide into Collapsible A as it drifted free; Those other sources, which include OASOG, indicate that the Lindells missed the boat and had to swim for several minutes to reach it. Edvard Lindell managed to (or was helped) to get on board but ws so cold and exhausted that he drifted into unconsciousness and soon died. Wennerstrom tried to help Elin Lindell but could not and she too soon drifted away to her death.
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Seumas
Member
I freely admit, I've got this one wrong.
It would be good if the full, unexpurgated text of Wennestrom's account can be posted. Just had a look there in "Memories of a Maiden Voyage" but couldn't find it.
Arun Vajpey
Member
As this discussion about Wennerstrom was taking this thread off topic, I have quoted your comment while refreshing the man's ET bio.
