"These kind of tales may make some people feel all warm and fuzzy inside but the evidence tells a very different story."
Nah, it's not in the film.
Yes some of the stories were made up. That's pretty obvious. I could see him giving the command at the end about "you've done your duty, every man for himself or however it went. As for the "myth" of the stoicism and all that the only thing I would comment about that is that I thought the way the British people handled WW2, the Battle of Britain, Dunkirk, the Blitz, D-day, ect. was pretty impressive. Of course that might have just have been a generational thing. Probably get a different response today. Cheers.
I could see him giving the command at the end about "you've done your duty, every man for himself or however it went.
While it is true that the Titanic's engineers did their duty to their best, there would have been little point in any of them remaining in the engine rooms till the very end. And while none of them survived, IG has gathered evidence that several survivors reported seeing some engineers they know by sight on the boat deck - including Chief Engineer Bell at one stage.
Again, there would have been no point. While the traditionally romantic notion of a postal employee doing his duty through doomsday might sound inspirational, it makes little practical sense. Moreover, by 12:15 am the mail rooms were almost completely flooded and uninhabitable.
No disrespect intended but that "Be British!" quip sounds the corniest of them all. Other than the silliness of it, such a statement would have justifiably made many non-British crew like Bo'sun Nichols, Postal Clerk John March, cellist Roger Bricoux etc (if they was still alive towards the end) and others feel that there was a hidden implication that only the British steadfastly did their duty under crisis.
To be fair ( or unfair, depending on the way one looks at it), Joughin might have had a sip or three of booze that night but that almost certainly played no part in his survival. As it has been repeatedly pointed out, drinking alcohol under such conditions significantly increased the risk of hypothermia and death.
Absolutely true. I have never believed in or felt comfortable with such pseudo-inspirations either hands-on or hearsay. Reality in the face of nature is usually cold and relentless.
Arun, Seumas. Thank you for the replies. Interesting to read your take on this. I'll just make 2 quick comments from both your replies. 1. What I admired about the brits was they were up against it but didn't give up. Other countries folded like a warm tortilla when they could have made a better showing.
With respect Steve, I think that there is a slight bias to that statement. I'll tell you why I feel that way.
No I don't mind at all. In fact there's nothing in your reply that I disagree with. I should have made myself clearer. What I meant by that statement was in relation to the brits during WW2. Not the people on Titanic. I was refering to countries that surrendered to the nazi's as fast as they did. To quote Winston Churchill..."What, so soon?" I believe the passengers and crew of Titanic of all countries with a few exceptions from individuals conducted themselves in a manner that I don't think would happen today from some recent examples we've seen. I should have said "in relation to the war" when I was talking about folding up. Cheers.With respect Steve, I think that there is a slight bias to that statement. I'll tell you why I feel that way.
Let us take the Titanic's crew first since by the very nature of the crisis situation they were the more pro-active out of the two categories of people on the ship. The majority of them, including many survivors, showed real grit; but then the majority of them were Brits and so there is not much room for a fair comparison. Those Irish who were or considered themselves as non-Brits did equally well across their smaller spectrum. Of other non-Brits, the Aussie Alfred Nichols stands out and while there is rather sketchy information about him in the latter part of the sinking, what is known strongly suggests that he kept his nerve and did well. Three of the 5 postal clerks - March, Gwinn and Woody - were Americans and there is no evidence to suggest that they did any less well than their two Brit colleagues Williamson and Jago-Smith.
The passengers' reactions are harder to quantify because there were too many variable - class, location, co-travellers (eg family), language barrier, confrontations with crew (in some cases) etc. But even with all that, I admit that certain section of passengers did better than others, but there were Brits and other nationalities in both groups. The Scandinavians in general stood up well, as did most Brits, Irish and Americans. Since there are no reports of Straus, Astor, Thayer, Widener, Ryerson etc tried to force themselves into any lifeboat, we have to accept that they, like many other rich Americans who did not survive bravely accepted their fate. In fact, if I was asked to name my beau ideal of passenger(s) on board the Titanic in terms of known gentlemanly behaviour and actions, I would quote the American father and son duo of Percival and Richard White.
There have been statements and suggestions that many passengers from countries in southern Europe and the Middle East did not quite measure-up when the crunch came. Even allowing for stereotyped bias and later press embellishment - both common in those days, I admit that there is probably some truth in it. But I would not go so far as to accuse them of "folding-up like tortillas".
I hope you do not mind this post.
I can very well understand his feelings. William Major was rescued on Lifeboat #13 and there was quite a crowd around it and lifeboat #15, which were loaded and lowered almost together. There were people on both the boat deck and A-decks, a lot of shouting I expect as scouts were being sent out to find more women and children etc. For William Major and other occupants of #13, the experienced of drifting sharply due to the condenser exhaust and then coming under Lifeboat #15 that was almost lowered on top of them must have been a frightening experience.
Yes, having read up about it myself it must have be very traumatic. I imagine much of his reasoning for not speaking about it comes from a combination of survivor's guilt and ptsd, which again tie into the image of the 'British Stiff Upper Lip' and male survivors being perceived as lesser, in some way.
Probably true from his own perspective, but as a fireman, he was almost certainly ordered into the lifeboat by Murdoch or Moody to help with the rowing.
That was my thinking, but I imagine it didn't count for much in his head. He probably had to face bereaved relatives of his crewmates regularly, it must have been very difficult.
