Possible Captain Smith Suicide

Senan, that's quite similar to the McGann article I have. Although it's a bit more fleshed out in yours, the details in both are virtually identical. I'll post it tomorrow for comparison.

Cheers!

Roy

>>But as Inger suggests, the neutral course suggests neither the heroic nor the cowardly, but the prosaic.

Precisely!
 
Question is...where is the baby?

There wasn't one on the overturned collapsible and I think that any such would have been noticed by somebody, and I'm not aware of any *reliable* accounts of babies being passed into a lifeboat from anyone in the water. (Although I may have missed it.). It makes for a great story, and I'd like for it to be true. The problem is that the available evidence is anything but conclusive.
 
I think the point is that the baby-to-lifeboat might have been a bit of embellishment by either crew or reporters, Mike (or, just possibly, Smith did jump with either a baby or young girl, as per McGann's account, who was lost on contact with the water). The common thread is Smith making it to a lifeboat briefly, but no further. That's why Roy and Senan are talking about the possibility of a kernal of truth in these reports. The baby is not a universal element in these stories - Rostron, for example, makes no mention of it when refering to the (anonymous) crew accounts he cites.

I wish I could claim round-the-clock powers of invincible wakefulness, Roy! But the truth is I posted that at a comfortable antipodean AM hour.

I owe you some sheet music too, I seem to recall...
 
One can see how easily stories merge to the "closest point of poignancy" in any disaster. There is subtle, even subconscious, shaping.

Look at McGann again. He is NOT talking about a baby - although we pass that by in our half-desire for corroboration. I was interested to see if anyone would take up that point.

McGann is talking about children who seem to be standing on the deck, crying. "Little kiddies" and "little girl" - could be up to age ten, I'd say, depending on what you mean by little.

If there were kids still around at that time (and there were, shameful scores of them), it is a thoroughgoing indictment. If two were on the bridge with the Captain and the last remnants of his command, it must have been deeply horrible.

(It may be possible they were there, given Gracie's mass of humanity that emerged from the superstructure just before inundation.)

If a Captain or crewman jumped overboard with a ten-year-old under the arm, or a five-year-old, or a 14-year-old, or a baby, it was a human and a humane response - one that ought to be automatic in the species homo sapiens.

Not heroic. Just ineffably sad.
 
Even 'Nacht Und Ice' includes a scene at the very end where Smith makes it to a lifeboat (I believe with child), gets he/she to safety, but swims away and eventually loses strength and goes under. Being made a few months after the disaster, maybe that film really helped "fuel" the myth?
 
"...it was a human and a humane response - one that ought to be automatic in the species homo sapiens. "
Hear, hear. Although I have to admit that my now-strapping sons have made me promise to repress any life-saving instincts in a disaster situation, on the grounds that I am now so much more feeble than they are I would probably only get in the way, and get the lot of us killed. They are quite right, of course, but would it work?

It's not just humans, but perhaps other mammals with consciousness and empathy. I once saw a very odd thing in a park in Leeds. A man's dog stared at the pond and noticed, which no humans seemed to have, a struggling gosling with its head under water - probably water-logged feathers. S(he) jumped in and carefully brought it out. Unfortunately, the dog only got attacked by the mother goose as a reward.
 
Hi, Michael, Inger, Senan and all!

Michael, as I said, I think the Baby-on-Collapsible-B story is a crock. And again, I believe that the newspaper drawing of the alleged baby-rescue taints our attitude toward the legend being not entirely true, but not entirely false. McGann is the only crewman I've personally found who mentioned a child of any age at this point. Actually, two - but even there he didn't say they were both girls. What I find truthful about his story is that he put the captain in the right place at the right time, in the middle of considerable chaos. Mrs. Widener and Harold Bride both corroborate the time and place, although not the children.

THE SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER
April 20, 1912, p.5:

SURVIVOR DESCRIBES HEROISM OF CAPTAIN

NEW YORK, Saturday, April 20.--Taking refuge on the bridge of the ill-fated Titanic two little children remained by the side of Captain Smith until that portion of the big ship had been swept by water. Survivors of the crew, who went down with the Titanic, but were saved by climbing to [sic] an overturned lifeboat, told today of their gallant commander's efforts to save the life of one of the children. He died a sailor's death and the little girl who had entrusted her life to his care died with him.

"He held the little girl under one arm," said James McGann, a fireman, "as we jumped into the sea, and endeavored to reach the nearest lifeboat. I took the other child into my arms as I was swept from the bridge deck. When I was plunged into the cold water I was compelled to release my hold on the child and I am satisfied that the same thing happened to Captain Smith.

"I had gone to the bridge deck to assist in lowering a collapsible boat. The water was then coming over the bridge and we were unable to launch it properly. It was overturned and was used as a liferaft, some 30 or more of us, mostly firemen, clinging to it. Capt. Smith looked as if he was trying to keep back tears as he thought of the doomed ship.

"He turned to the men lowering the men lowering the boat and shouted, 'Well, boys, it's every man for himself.' He then took one of the children standing by him on the bridge and jumped into the sea. He endeavored to reach the overturned boat, but did not succeed. That was the last I saw of Captain Smith."
McGann said Captain Smith directed the lowering of the lifeboats. He said the story that Captain Smith had committed suicide as the Titanic went down is untrue.

____________

The next article touches on some of the same points, minus the children. It credits the crewman as AB George Hogg, although Hogg signed on as a lookout. Other problems with it include "Hogg" being on Collapsible B, when in fact he was in charge of #7 (starboard). I think what may have happened is that the reporter got his story, but with a room full of 150 Titanic crewmen, he mixed up on the name.


THE SEATTLE DAILY TIMES
April 20, 1912, p.5 (extract):

CAPTAIN SMITH WOULD NOT ACCEPT RESCUE

NEW YORK, Saturday, April 20 . . .

Tells of Captain’s End.

At the American Seamen’s Friend Society’s Institute, where 150 members of the rescued crew of the Titanic are being fed, clothed and housed, G. A. Hogg, able seaman, told last night of the fate of Captain Smith. Hogg says that as the Titanic sank, a big wave washed over the side and he landed on a raft carrying thirty-five persons.

“The next moment, I saw Captain Smith in the water alongside the raft. ‘There’s the skipper,’ I yelled, ‘give him a hand,’ and then I did. But he shook himself free and shouted to us, ‘Good bye, boys, I am going to follow the ship.’ That was the last we saw of the skipper.”

Hogg said that later they were transferred to a lifeboat, in which there was an unclothed woman. She was numb with the cold and some of the men took off their clothes and wrapped her up in them, but she died soon after. Sidney Humphrey [sic--"Humphries"], the quartermaster, said he dragged two women out of the water, one of them a raving maniac, who died before the Carpathia picked up the lifeboats.

____________

Mrs. Widener was in Boat #4 and placed Captain Smith's jumping (no children) at virtually the same time as McGann. More troubling is that she apparently witnessed an officer take his own life on the port side. In this she is supported by Anna Sjöblom, said to be in #16 (but more likely in #10), who spoke of the same incident to reporters in Tacoma, Washington, on April 29.


THE SEATTLE DAILY TIMES
April 20, 1912, p.5:

MRS. WIDENER TELLS OF LOSING HER LOVED ONES

PHILADELPHIA, Saturday, April 20.--Mrs. George D. Widener, whose husband, a well-known financier of this city, and their son, were drowned in the Titanic wreck, said she saw Captain Smith jump from the bridge into the sea and that a moment previous she had seen another officer send a revolver bullet into his brain.

“Mr. Widener and I had retired for the night,” she said, “when the shock of crashing into the iceberg occurred. We thought little of it and did not leave our cabin. We must have remained there an hour before becoming fearful. Then Mr. Widener went to our son Harry’s room and brought him to our cabin. Harry then went out, but hurried back and told us we must go on deck. Mr. Widener and Harry, a few minutes later[,] went on deck and aided the officers, who were having trouble with steerage passengers. That was the last I saw of my husband or son.

“I was put into a lifeboat[*]. As the boat pulled away from the Titanic I saw one of the officers shoot himself in the head, and a few minutes later saw Captain Smith jump from the bridge into the sea.” [emphasis added]

[*] Note.--Boat #4 [Br. 1.55 am; WFB 1:50 am]; Quartermaster W.J. Perkis in charge.


THE TACOMA NEWS TRIBUNE
April 30, 1912, p.7 (extract):

Girl Titanic Survivor, Now Here, Tells Story of Fearful Experience
Says She Still Hears Awful Shriek of Despair That Went Up as Great Vessel Finally Plunged From View--Young Immigrant Gives Graphic Detailed Account.


“I saw so many things, so many terrible things, that sometimes I can hardly remember anything. It seems just as if I wanted to rest my mind a long time,” said Anna Sjoblom, 18, the first survivor of the Titanic disaster to cross the continent to Tacoma. Miss Sjoblom arrived in Tacoma yesterday afternoon and is staying with her uncle and aunt, Mr. and Mrs. Andrew Nelson, 1016 North Steele street. One of the most vivid descriptions yet given of the horror, from the time the iceberg was struck, through the scenes of terror on the deck of the sinking ship, of the tragedies in the icy water, and of the rescue of the survivors by the Carpathia, is told by this girl, who became 18 the day of the wreck. . . .

“The lifeboat was so crowded that I sat on a man’s knee and had a woman on my lap. Several others did the same. There wasn’t room for another person in the boat. When we rowed away from the Titanic my face was towards the sinking steamer, and the things I saw I never will forget. I saw an officer shoot himself through the temple with a revolver. I saw passengers throw themselves overboard, shrieking for help. I saw men in the water, floating on lifebelts, who were crusted with ice so thick that you could hardly make out their faces. I saw dead bodies floating about, covered with ice. Oh, it was too terrible to talk about. . . .”

____________

Harold Bride supported the time and place (again, no children) in his US testimony:

UNITED STATES SENATE INQUIRY
Saturday, April 20, 1912.
Testimony of Harold Bride
(extract). . . .

Senator SMITH: When did you last see the captain? When he told you to take care of yourself?

Mr. BRIDE: The last I saw of the captain he went overboard from the bridge, sir [emphasis added].

Senator SMITH: Did you see the Titanic sink?

Mr. BRIDE: Yes, sir.

Senator SMITH: And the captain was at that time on the bridge?

Mr. BRIDE: No, sir.

Senator SMITH: What do you mean by overboard?

Mr. BRIDE: He jumped overboard from the bridge. He jumped overboard from the bridge when we were launching the collapsible lifeboat [emphasis added].

Senator SMITH: I should judge from what you have said that this was about three or four minutes before the boat sank.

Mr. BRIDE: Yes. It would be just about five minutes before the boat sank.

Senator SMITH: About five minutes?

Mr. BRIDE: Yes.

Senator SMITH: Do you know whether the captain had a life belt on?

Mr. BRIDE: He had not when I last saw him.

Senator SMITH: He had not?

Mr. BRIDE: No, sir.

Senator SMITH: Did the bridge go under water at about the same time?

Mr. BRIDE: Yes, sir. The whole of the ship was practically under water to the forward funnel, and when I saw her go down the stern came out of the water and she slid down fore and aft.

Senator SMITH: The captain at no time went over until the vessel sank?

Mr. BRIDE: No, sir.

Senator SMITH: He went with the vessel?

Mr. BRIDE: Practically speaking; yes, sir [emphasis added]. . . .

____________

Cheers, m'dears!

Roy
 
Excellent! I'll be back here on Tuesday.

Merry Christmas!
Happy Hanukka!
Happy Quanza!
Happy Solstice!
Happy Saturnalia!
Happy Holidays!
Season's Greetings!

(Here's hoping I covered everything!)
:-)

Roy
 
>(Here's hoping I covered everything!)<

You probably got most of what's celebrated today so I'll offer the same wishes in return.

Regarding the stories, whatever one may say of them, they are at least broadly consistant with what Bride entered into sworn testimony, and the chaos described is consistant with what one would expect in a real world shipwreck.
 
Hey Roy, how can you forget Happy New Year?
happy.gif
We can also start something new. How about "Bon Perhelia" in honor of the upcoming perihelion passage on Jan 4th?
 
Too much egg nog can get too the brain can't it Mike? (I hate that stuff!)

Merry Christmas everybody! It is officially Christmas Day here in Atlanta (12:52am). To all the Jewish Titanic fanatics on the board I say Happy Hannukah, because they fall on the same day this year, yea!

Back on topic, the baby story is pretty ridiculous to me. I think it was just a flight of someone's imagination, wanting to over-glorify Smith. Did Smith kill himself? Probably not but he likely made peace with the fact that his life would end that night. But I doubt he was thinking about it much during most of those two hours. He had too much on his hands to think about his mortality until perhaps the last 30 minutes. He was trying to make sure as many people as possible got off the boat and when all the lifeboats had gone, I presume he had lost all energy or will to live. He also probably want to save room on the boats so that when they came back (ha ha), as many of the remaining people could be saved as possible. In his mind, he would just hog space and that would be highly ungentlemanly. What would he gain by surviving? Unending ridicule (a. la Ismay), just 15 more bittersweet years with his family (he was up in years) and a warm bed to die in. "It's my time," he probably thought. He then said a prayer and waited to die with his ship. Call that suicide, or call it whatever; that's what I think happened. Sadly, Smith is unable to tell us what happened, we can only speculate, but I don't think he had any expectations of surviving from the news of the damage to the final plunge.
 
Why would he want to commit suicide? It wasnt as though it was his fault, and although god only knows what might have been running through his head when placed in such an unbelieveable and ironic and cruel and crazily brutal situation, the fact was that he had signed a piece of paper at the beginging of the voyage and accepted his responsibility. A responsibility that earnt him his money - alowed him £105 a month compared to a stokers 5. It was his job to take the Titanic and the 2200 on board to New York safely. That was no longer possible and if he couldnt save them, how could he save himself? He would have had to have died. I think we can forgive him for seeming a little distracted while his officers got to work on the boat deck....

A theory that I have wondered about was how there was nothing to stop him shaving off that beard,slipping on a nice dress and hopping in a boat....I think i heard of a man that reported seeing the captain in some country and thought he was crazy after soon after hearing of the sinking and his loss! They never did find his body. Who knows...but its safer and much nicer to think he did what he did and couldnt possibly do more and unfortunately died with the ship.
 
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