The Six Mystery Crewman

2nd Officer Charles Lightoller sent six AB Seamen below to open the port side gangway door so that more passengers could be loaded from there into the already launched lifeboats that had more room in them.
Does anyone know the names of those six seamen, and are there any solid theories as to what became of them, the path that they took, and where they might have become trapped?
If this has already been discussed, please accept my apologies.
If not, I am very curious as to who they were and what became of them, other than the obvious which is that they became trapped.
Thanks in advance for any insights that You may have!
 
I think I posted a similar thread a couple of years ago and am guessing that the Mods will soon merge this thread with that one.

Going by Lightoller's testimony (and only that), just after 01:00 am Boatswain Alfred Nichols arrived in the vicinity of Lifeboat #6 where the Second officer was supervising loading. The two men worked together for a few minutes and then Lightoller reportedly ordered Nichols to pick 6 men and go down and open the gangway door on E-deck (or was it D-deck? opinions vary) on the port side. Presumably, Lightoller's idea was to load more passengers and crew through that opening at a later stage. Nichols left Lightoller at 01:05 am to carry out that order at 01:05 am and the two men never saw each other again.

Assuming that Lightoller did give that order, it was Nichols who picked those 6 sailors wand went below with them and so only he and those six would have known each others' identities. Whether they actually tried to open a gangway door remains conjectural but by 01:10 am the sea level would have been almost to the threshold of the door on E-deck on the port side. Therefore, either Nichols and his men did not open that door at all or opened it slightly, realized the impracticality of that order and closed it again. Certainly, no one in Lifeboat #6, which was launched at 01:10 am, saw an open gangway door on the port side as the boat went past.

I personally feel, as many others do, that the surmise in some works that Nichols and his men were washed away and killed during that attempt is very unlikely because they were experienced sailors and would have taken due precautions. Also, there were at least 2 sightings of Alfred Nichols after 01:10 am.

There is the possibility that Nichols and his men then opened the gangway door on D-deck, that was a deck level higher and further aft and so well above the water level. More likely, they decided not to open any gangway doors at all. In any case, they would have returned to the boat deck soon afterwards and the logical thing is to assume is that Nichols would then have dismissed his 6 men, who would have gone about other duties. AFAIK, no crew survivor came forward to report that he was one of those 6 men and so one has to assume that they died later during the sinking at various posts where they happened to be. Since Nichols himself did not survive, no one else could have known the identities of those 6 crewmen.

By then it would have been close to 01:30 am and (unbeknown to Nichols), Lightoller would have moved to A-deck to continue his struggles with Lifeboat #4. Nichols probably reported to Wilde near Lifeboat #2 and was seen by Saloon Watchman James Johnstone, who received the well documented 'star tip' from the boatswain. Thereafter, Nichols likely went to the starboard side aft to help out and was reportedly seen by Leading Fireman Frederick Barrett, to whom Nichols ordered to get into Lifeboat #13 and 'pull an oar'.

There are no further documented statements about Nichols but in all likelihood, he continued to work with Murdoch and/or Moody and ultimately died with them.
 
Arun,
This is fantastic information.
Thank you for a very thorough and well studied response.
I appreciate knowing this.
I have always wondered about the "missing six."
Thank You!
 
I think I posted a similar thread a couple of years ago and am guessing that the Mods will soon merge this thread with that one.

Going by Lightoller's testimony (and only that), just after 01:00 am Boatswain Alfred Nichols arrived in the vicinity of Lifeboat #6 where the Second officer was supervising loading. The two men worked together for a few minutes and then Lightoller reportedly ordered Nichols to pick 6 men and go down and open the gangway door on E-deck (or was it D-deck? opinions vary) on the port side. Presumably, Lightoller's idea was to load more passengers and crew through that opening at a later stage. Nichols left Lightoller at 01:05 am to carry out that order at 01:05 am and the two men never saw each other again.

Assuming that Lightoller did give that order, it was Nichols who picked those 6 sailors wand went below with them and so only he and those six would have known each others' identities. Whether they actually tried to open a gangway door remains conjectural but by 01:10 am the sea level would have been almost to the threshold of the door on E-deck on the port side. Therefore, either Nichols and his men did not open that door at all or opened it slightly, realized the impracticality of that order and closed it again. Certainly, no one in Lifeboat #6, which was launched at 01:10 am, saw an open gangway door on the port side as the boat went past.

I personally feel, as many others do, that the surmise in some works that Nichols and his men were washed away and killed during that attempt is very unlikely because they were experienced sailors and would have taken due precautions. Also, there were at least 2 sightings of Alfred Nichols after 01:10 am.

There is the possibility that Nichols and his men then opened the gangway door on D-deck, that was a deck level higher and further aft and so well above the water level. More likely, they decided not to open any gangway doors at all. In any case, they would have returned to the boat deck soon afterwards and the logical thing is to assume is that Nichols would then have dismissed his 6 men, who would have gone about other duties. AFAIK, no crew survivor came forward to report that he was one of those 6 men and so one has to assume that they died later during the sinking at various posts where they happened to be. Since Nichols himself did not survive, no one else could have known the identities of those 6 crewmen.

By then it would have been close to 01:30 am and (unbeknown to Nichols), Lightoller would have moved to A-deck to continue his struggles with Lifeboat #4. Nichols probably reported to Wilde near Lifeboat #2 and was seen by Saloon Watchman James Johnstone, who received the well documented 'star tip' from the boatswain. Thereafter, Nichols likely went to the starboard side aft to help out and was reportedly seen by Leading Fireman Frederick Barrett, to whom Nichols ordered to get into Lifeboat #13 and 'pull an oar'.

There are no further documented statements about Nichols but in all likelihood, he continued to work with Murdoch and/or Moody and ultimately died with them.
maybe the where killed in the tumult later or hurted ...maybe jack, too...
 
maybe the where killed in the tumult later

That's my conjecture. IF the sequence of events started the way Lightoller claimed - ie him ordering Nichols to pick 6 crewmen and go below etc, those 6 crewmen very likely were among the 1500+ people who died on the Titanic at later stages. Since Nichols also died, no other survivor knows the identity of those six men.
 
I have been discussing with Craig Stringer on the issue of Lightoller's testimony about his order to Boatswain Alfred Nichols at about 01:05 am to take 6 men, go below-decks and open a port side Gangway door ostensibly to be used for loading further people after lifeboats were lowered partially loaded via davits. The two men were working on loading Lifeboat #6 at the time and Lightoller said that after Nichols left him to carry out this order, he never saw the boatswain or the men again. This led many early Titanic researchers to believe that Nichols and his men were overcome by sudden flooding below when they tried to open the gangway door and perished en masse. But further research about this issue, notably by Brad Payne, has strongly suggested that this could not have been the case. Apart from the fact that 7 experienced sailors would not have exposed themselves to such danger without taking due precautions, Brad found that at least 2 crew survivors recalled seeing Nichols long after he is supposed to have drowned near the gangway door. Also, Lightoller could not have known whether one or more of those other 6 men survived because he would not have known their identities IF events had transpired like he claimed.

Over the years, there have been different and divided opinions about this, ranging from which deck gangway door was Nichols supposed to open (D or E deck?) to what happened to Nichols and his men and why Lightoller never saw the boatswain again. Some, quite rightly, have questioned whether Lightoller, who is often considered as an unreliable witness, gave that order at all in the first place. A recent discussion with Craig over PMs had me thinking and looking at the whole thing again; I have put down my thoughts - I stress they are just that.

I agree with my colleague who feels that Lightoller was first of all a "Good Company Man" and would not say or do anything that would make WSL stand out in questionable light. I have always felt that of all the major characters who lived and died through the disaster, Second Officer Charles Lightoller had the most deeply ingrained sense of self-preservation. In other words, not only he had no intentions of dying in the sinking himself but also of making sure that his career did not suffer afterwards. I am not claiming that Lightoller had any pre-conceived plan to save himself at the expense of anyone else; but he was instinctively and perhaps sub-consciously on the lookout of what to him would be the 'ideal' opportunity to save himself after he had done his duty to passengers & crew as he saw it.

That order to open gangway doors on a ship starting to list to port (by then) and sinking by the head was a very questionable one and Lightoller himself knew it. But at the British Inquiry into the disaster, he effectively admitted to not only giving that order to Nichols but also its questionability. See below:

13900. Now let us pursue the two things you have mentioned. You say you gave those orders to the boatswain to go down with some men and open the gangway doors?
- Yes.


13901. Will you point out on the starboard side where they are?
- There are gangway doors one on each side there. (
Pointing on the model.)

13902. About where you are pointing now?
- Yes, there are two doors one above and one below on the starboard side, but there is only one on E deck on the port side. The other gangway doors are here.

13903. In the afterpart?
- Yes.

13903a. What deck do those gangway doors open from?
- E deck.

13904. Were your orders general, or did they refer to one set of gangway doors in particular?
- General.

13905. Did the boatswain go off after receiving the orders?
- As far as I know, he went down.

13907. If the boat was down by the head, the opening of those doors on E deck in the forward part of the ship would open her very close to the water, would it not?
- Yes.


13908. When you gave the order, had you got in mind that the ship was tending to go down by the head, or had not you yet noticed it?
- I cannot say that I had noticed it particularly.

13909. Of course, you know now the water was rising up to E deck?
- Yes, of course it was.

13910. Did the boatswain execute those orders?
- That I could not say. He merely said "Aye, aye, sir," and went off
.

Having admitted to giving that order, Lightoller is clearly on the defensive here, agreeing that it was perhaps not such a good idea. So, the question arises WHY Charles Lightoller, Second and senior most surviving Officer of the lost Titanic, a good company man and above all someone who always looked after himself, make a claim that was effectively shooting himself in both feet? After all, by the second day on board the Carpathia, Lightoller would have known that Nichols had not made it; the only two other people who might have known about that order were Captain Smith and Chief Officer Wilde but they too died in the sinking. Therefore, on surface it would seem that there was no one alive who could have told anyone else that Lightoller gave the gangway door order at all.

Another member posted that Lightoller said somewhere that he saw neither Nichols nor his 6 men again. (I have not been able to find that statement myself and would be grateful for an update.) If true, that strikes as a very odd statement to me; both #13905 and #13910 above indicate that Nichols left Lightoller near Lifeboat #6 and went off to carry out that order. That clearly implies that Nichols picked those men himself and went down with them; therefore, Lightoller would not have known their identities at the time. So, how can he know that he never saw any of them again?

But more than anything else, Lightoller's statement about that order during the inquiry very strongly indicates that it was true; otherwise, he would never have admitted to what was effectively a very questionable plan.


I believe that there is a legitimate explanation as to why Lightoller never saw Nichols again:
  • The two men parted company at about 01:05 am and Nichols left to carry out the order while Lightoller continued to supervise loading and lowering Lifeboat #6.
  • It would have taken Nichols a few minutes to round-up his 6 men, go below-decks and check the practicalities of that order. As experienced seamen on board a sinking ship, they would not have blindly opened any gangway door but assessed the risks and options first.
  • Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #6 at about 01:10 am and himself went to the Officer's Quarters for that brief "Firearms Meeting".
  • Lifeboat #6 would have rowed past the gangway doors somewhere between 01:10 am and 01:15 am; no one on board - including characters like Hichens, Molly Brown, Peuchen etc - noticed any open gangway door as far as is known.
  • The firearms meeting would have lasted only a few minutes and by 01:20 am Wilde (lifeboat #16) and Lightoller (Lifeboat #12) would have arrived at port side aft where Moody and Lowe had been loading Lifeboats #16, #14 and #12 simultaneously.
  • Meanwhile, Nichols and his team below decks would have been assessing the practicalities of opening a gangway door; IMO, they would have decided not to open the E-deck door at all because it would have been very close to the sea level by then. They might have tired to open the D-deck door instead but very likely closed it again (or never opened it) for the same reason that it was impractical and dangerous. All that would have taken time and it would have been just after 01:30 am by the time Nichols and his men started making their way back to the boat deck.
  • Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #12 at 01:30 am and then went to where he had lowered Lifeboat #4 on the A-deck. To do that, my forum Craig Stringer believes that Lightoller would have preferred to avoid being delayed on the increasingly crowded boat deck and would have taken the stairs near the deck chair store down to the A-deck and then walked forward along it to where Lifeboat #4 was positioned; I agree. If Lightoller had done that, he would not have passed anywhere near Lifeboat #2 at the time (see below).
  • Nichols would have arrived on the boat deck, dismissed his 6 men to other tasks and gone forward on the port side to report his actions - NOT opening any gangway door. He would not have seen Lightoller (for reasons mentioned above) but met Captain Smith and probably Wilde near Lifeboat #2, which was even then being loaded. Nichols would also have seen James Johnstone and realizing that the latter was part of the crew of Lifeboat #2, gave him the now famous "watch the star" tip. It would have been around 01:35 am by then and it is likely that either Smith or Wilde then ordered Nichols to relieve Murdoch at Lifeboats #13 and #15 so that the First Officer could attend to Lifeboat #10.
  • Nichols left the scene before Boxhall completed his rocket firing and arrived to take charge of Lifeboat #2, which explains why the Fourth Officer also did not see the Boatswain. Lifeboat #2 was lowered only at 01:45 am.
  • Nichols found Murdoch loading Lifeboat #13 on A-deck and relieved him there so that the First Officer could cross over to the port side and attend to Lifeboat #10.
  • Moments later, Leading fireman Barrett arrived on A-deck where Lifeboat #13 was about to be lowered. He found Nichols in charge but no officer; but Barrett could hear an officer giving orders up on the boat deck (Moody at Lifeboat #15). Nichols ordered Barrett to get into Lifeboat #13 and "pull an oar"
  • Meanwhile, Lightoller continued to load Lifeboat #4 on the port side forward. On the starboard side forward, McElroy started loading Collapsible C.
  • After Lifeboats #13 and #15 were lowered and (after a few scary moments) rowed away safely, Moody and Nichols went forward to where McElroy was loading Collapsible C. Moody and probably Nichols got on to the roof of the Captain's quarters to try and release the lashed down Collapsible A.
  • Murdoch lowered Lifeboat #10 at 0:50 am and crossed over to join McElroy to continue loading Collapsible C. On the port side, Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #4 also around 01:50 am and went to where Collapsible D was being fitted to the davits of Lifeboat #2, probably under Wilde's supervision.
  • Moody asked for the block & tackle equipment to assist in freeing and positioning Collapsible A. As this kit was stored in the Boatswain's quarters, Nichols left to get them.
  • While Nichols was away, Lightoller left Wilde briefly to pop over to the starboard side where Collapsible C was being loaded. He saw Murdoch, McElroy, doctors O-Loughlin & Simpson and Assistant Purser Barker with the latter jokingly asking the second officer if he was warm. Lightoller does not see Nichols (see above) before he returns to the port side.
That explains IMO why Lightoller never saw Boatswain Nichols after the two men parted company at around 01:05 am near Lifeboat #6. After Collapsible D was launched at 0205 am, things became too crowded, noisy and hectic and so it would have been difficult for anyone to spot someone they knew unless they were directly interacting with that person.

But what of Nichol's six men? What happened to them? IMO there are 3 possibilities.
  1. After they returned to the boat deck and dismissed by Nichols, the men went about other tasks and ultimately all perished in the sinking. While this is certainly possible, probably slightly against the law of averages as applied to that night.
  2. Two or three of them survived but were not called to testify in either Inquiry. Rather more plausible but the chances are high that over the ensuing years, at least one of them would have talked about that futile expedition below-decks. AFAIK, there is no such record.
  3. Lightoller learned while on board the Carpathia that Nichols did not survive but would have received a report from one of surviving Nichols' men about the futile trip below. He would have then spoken to that man and other two survivors that it was in their best interests to say nothing about the gangway door attempt and to leave everything to him.
But Lightoller could not be sure that one or more of the surviving Nichols' six would not talk at some stage later. The only way he could counter this was to admit to giving that order himself - like he actually did. That way, he would get off with mild criticism that he received rather than risk being caught out on a lie at a later stage.

Craig Stringer has another explanation which is simpler and covers almost all eventualities from Lightoller's point of view. Craig agreed with me that Lightoller almost certainly gave the gangway door order but unbeknown to him either Captain Smith or Wilde countermanded it so that the "Gangway Door expedition" never took place. The only issue I have with that is that after Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #6, he went to the 'firearms meeting' where Smith, Wilde and Murdoch - the only people who could have overruled Lightoller - were present. Had one of them countermanded the Second Officer's orders only a few minutes earlier, would they not have told him so? And if they had, why would Lightoller need to have mentioned giving that order during the British Inquiry?
 
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I have been discussing with Craig Stringer on the issue of Lightoller's testimony about his order to Boatswain Alfred Nichols at about 01:05 am to take 6 men, go below-decks and open a port side Gangway door ostensibly to be used for loading further people after lifeboats were lowered partially loaded via davits. The two men were working on loading Lifeboat #6 at the time and Lightoller said that after Nichols left him to carry out this order, he never saw the boatswain or the men again. This led many early Titanic researchers to believe that Nichols and his men were overcome by sudden flooding below when they tried to open the gangway door and perished en masse. But further research about this issue, notably by Brad Payne, has strongly suggested that this could not have been the case. Apart from the fact that 7 experienced sailors would not have exposed themselves to such danger without taking due precautions, Brad found that at least 2 crew survivors recalled seeing Nichols long after he is supposed to have drowned near the gangway door. Also, Lightoller could not have known whether one or more of those other 6 men survived because he would not have known their identities IF events had transpired like he claimed.

Over the years, there have been different and divided opinions about this, ranging from which deck gangway door was Nichols supposed to open (D or E deck?) to what happened to Nichols and his men and why Lightoller never saw the boatswain again. Some, quite rightly, have questioned whether Lightoller, who is often considered as an unreliable witness, gave that order at all in the first place. A recent discussion with Craig over PMs had me thinking and looking at the whole thing again; I have put down my thoughts - I stress they are just that.

I agree with my colleague who feels that Lightoller was first of all a "Good Company Man" and would not say or do anything that would make WSL stand out in questionable light. I have always felt that of all the major characters who lived and died through the disaster, Second Officer Charles Lightoller had the most deeply ingrained sense of self-preservation. In other words, not only he had no intentions of dying in the sinking himself but also of making sure that his career did not suffer afterwards. I am not claiming that Lightoller had any pre-conceived plan to save himself at the expense of anyone else; but he was instinctively and perhaps sub-consciously on the lookout of what to him would be the 'ideal' opportunity to save himself after he had done his duty to passengers & crew as he saw it.

That order to open gangway doors on a ship starting to list to port (by then) and sinking by the head was a very questionable one and Lightoller himself knew it. But at the British Inquiry into the disaster, he effectively admitted to not only giving that order to Nichols but also its questionability. See below:

13900. Now let us pursue the two things you have mentioned. You say you gave those orders to the boatswain to go down with some men and open the gangway doors?
- Yes.


13901. Will you point out on the starboard side where they are?
- There are gangway doors one on each side there. (
Pointing on the model.)

13902. About where you are pointing now?
- Yes, there are two doors one above and one below on the starboard side, but there is only one on E deck on the port side. The other gangway doors are here.

13903. In the afterpart?
- Yes.

13903a. What deck do those gangway doors open from?
- E deck.

13904. Were your orders general, or did they refer to one set of gangway doors in particular?
- General.

13905. Did the boatswain go off after receiving the orders?
- As far as I know, he went down.

13907. If the boat was down by the head, the opening of those doors on E deck in the forward part of the ship would open her very close to the water, would it not?
- Yes.


13908. When you gave the order, had you got in mind that the ship was tending to go down by the head, or had not you yet noticed it?
- I cannot say that I had noticed it particularly.

13909. Of course, you know now the water was rising up to E deck?
- Yes, of course it was.

13910. Did the boatswain execute those orders?
- That I could not say. He merely said "Aye, aye, sir," and went off
.

Having admitted to giving that order, Lightoller is clearly on the defensive here, agreeing that it was perhaps not such a good idea. So, the question arises WHY Charles Lightoller, Second and senior most surviving Officer of the lost Titanic, a good company man and above all someone who always looked after himself, make a claim that was effectively shooting himself in both feet? After all, by the second day on board the Carpathia, Lightoller would have known that Nichols had not made it; the only two other people who might have known about that order were Captain Smith and Chief Officer Wilde but they too died in the sinking. Therefore, on surface it would seem that there was no one alive who could have told anyone else that Lightoller gave the gangway door order at all.

Another member posted that Lightoller said somewhere that he saw neither Nichols nor his 6 men again. (I have not been able to find that statement myself and would be grateful for an update.) If true, that strikes as a very odd statement to me; both #13905 and #13910 above indicate that Nichols left Lightoller near Lifeboat #6 and went off to carry out that order. That clearly implies that Nichols picked those men himself and went down with them; therefore, Lightoller would not have known their identities at the time. So, how can he know that he never saw any of them again?

But more than anything else, Lightoller's statement about that order during the inquiry very strongly indicates that it was true; otherwise, he would never have admitted to what was effectively a very questionable plan.


I believe that there is a legitimate explanation as to why Lightoller never saw Nichols again:
  • The two men parted company at about 01:05 am and Nichols left to carry out the order while Lightoller continued to supervise loading and lowering Lifeboat #6.
  • It would have taken Nichols a few minutes to round-up his 6 men, go below-decks and check the practicalities of that order. As experienced seamen on board a sinking ship, they would not have blindly opened any gangway door but assessed the risks and options first.
  • Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #6 at about 01:10 am and himself went to the Officer's Quarters for that brief "Firearms Meeting".
  • Lifeboat #6 would have rowed past the gangway doors somewhere between 01:10 am and 01:15 am; no one on board - including characters like Hichens, Molly Brown, Peuchen etc - noticed any open gangway door as far as is known.
  • The firearms meeting would have lasted only a few minutes and by 01:20 am Wilde (lifeboat #16) and Lightoller (Lifeboat #12) would have arrived at port side aft where Moody and Lowe had been loading Lifeboats #16, #14 and #12 simultaneously.
  • Meanwhile, Nichols and his team below decks would have been assessing the practicalities of opening a gangway door; IMO, they would have decided not to open the E-deck door at all because it would have been very close to the sea level by then. They might have tired to open the D-deck door instead but very likely closed it again (or never opened it) for the same reason that it was impractical and dangerous. All that would have taken time and it would have been just after 01:30 am by the time Nichols and his men started making their way back to the boat deck.
  • Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #12 at 01:30 am and then went to where he had lowered Lifeboat #4 on the A-deck. To do that, my forum Craig Stringer believes that Lightoller would have preferred to avoid being delayed on the increasingly crowded boat deck and would have taken the stairs near the deck chair store down to the A-deck and then walked forward along it to where Lifeboat #4 was positioned; I agree. If Lightoller had done that, he would not have passed anywhere near Lifeboat #2 at the time (see below).
  • Nichols would have arrived on the boat deck, dismissed his 6 men to other tasks and gone forward on the port side to report his actions - NOT opening any gangway door. He would not have seen Lightoller (for reasons mentioned above) but met Captain Smith and probably Wilde near Lifeboat #2, which was even then being loaded. Nichols would also have seen James Johnstone and realizing that the latter was part of the crew of Lifeboat #2, gave him the now famous "watch the star" tip. It would have been around 01:35 am by then and it is likely that either Smith or Wilde then ordered Nichols to relieve Murdoch at Lifeboats #13 and #15 so that the First Officer could attend to Lifeboat #10.
  • Nichols left the scene before Boxhall completed his rocket firing and arrived to take charge of Lifeboat #2, which explains why the Fourth Officer also did not see the Boatswain. Lifeboat #2 was lowered only at 01:45 am.
  • Nichols found Murdoch loading Lifeboat #13 on A-deck and relieved him there so that the First Officer could cross over to the port side and attend to Lifeboat #10.
  • Moments later, Leading fireman Barrett arrived on A-deck where Lifeboat #13 was about to be lowered. He found Nichols in charge but no officer; but Barrett could hear an officer giving orders up on the boat deck (Moody at Lifeboat #15). Nichols ordered Barrett to get into Lifeboat #13 and "pull an oar"
  • Meanwhile, Lightoller continued to load Lifeboat #4 on the port side forward. On the starboard side forward, McElroy started loading Collapsible C.
  • After Lifeboats #13 and #15 were lowered and (after a few scary moments) rowed away safely, Moody and Nichols went forward to where McElroy was loading Collapsible C. Moody and probably Nichols got on to the roof of the Captain's quarters to try and release the lashed down Collapsible A.
  • Murdoch lowered Lifeboat #10 at 0:50 am and crossed over to join McElroy to continue loading Collapsible C. On the port side, Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #4 also around 01:50 am and went to where Collapsible D was being fitted to the davits of Lifeboat #2, probably under Wilde's supervision.
  • Moody asked for the block & tackle equipment to assist in freeing and positioning Collapsible A. As this kit was stored in the Boatswain's quarters, Nichols left to get them.
  • While Nichols was away, Lightoller left Wilde briefly to pop over to the starboard side where Collapsible C was being loaded. He saw Murdoch, McElroy, doctors O-Loughlin & Simpson and Assistant Purser Barker with the latter jokingly asking the second officer if he was warm. Lightoller does not see Nichols (see above) before he returns to the port side.
That explains IMO why Lightoller never saw Boatswain Nichols after the two men parted company at around 01:05 am near Lifeboat #6. After Collapsible D was launched at 0205 am, things became too crowded, noisy and hectic and so it would have been difficult for anyone to spot someone they knew unless they were directly interacting with that person.

But what of Nichol's six men? What happened to them? IMO there are 3 possibilities.
  1. After they returned to the boat deck and dismissed by Nichols, the men went about other tasks and ultimately all perished in the sinking. While this is certainly possible, probably slightly against the law of averages as applied to that night.
  2. Two or three of them survived but were not called to testify in either Inquiry. Rather more plausible but the chances are high that over the ensuing years, at least one of them would have talked about that futile expedition below-decks. AFAIK, there is no such record.
  3. Lightoller learned while on board the Carpathia that Nichols did not survive but would have received a report from one of surviving Nichols' men about the futile trip below. He would have then spoken to that man and other two survivors that it was in their best interests to say nothing about the gangway door attempt and to leave everything to him.
But Lightoller could not be sure that one or more of the surviving Nichols' six would not talk at some stage later. The only way he could counter this was to admit to giving that order himself - like he actually did. That way, he would get off with mild criticism that he received rather than risk being caught out on a lie at a later stage.

Craig Stringer has another explanation which is simpler and covers almost all eventualities from Lightoller's point of view. Craig agreed with me that Lightoller almost certainly gave the gangway door order but unbeknown to him either Captain Smith or Wilde countermanded it so that the "Gangway Door expedition" never took place. The only issue I have with that is that after Lightoller lowered Lifeboat #6, he went to the 'firearms meeting where Smith, Wilde and Murdoch - the only people who could have overruled Lightoller - were present. Had one of them countermanded the Second Officer's orders only a few minutes earlier, would they not have told him so? And if they had, why would Lightoller need to have mentioned giving that order during the British Inquiry?
Excellent Analysis!
 
There is one other bit of evidence that hasn’t been taken in consideration as far as I am aware to support that boatswain Nichols and his men didn’t die below deck, and that is the recovered bodies. Of the able bodied and ordinary seamen on-board ten died, these are the following brave men:

Able bodied seaman Thomas Henry Bradley (1883-1912)

Able bodied seaman George James Clench (1881-1912)

Able bodied seaman Frank Couch (1884-1912)

Able bodied seaman Stephen James Davis (1873-1912)

Able bodied seaman Harry Holman (1883-1912)

Able bodied seaman William Henry Lyons (1886-1912)

Able bodied seaman David Matherson (1879-1912)

Able bodied seaman Charles William Frederick Taylor (1871-1912)

Seaman William Smith (1886-1912)

Seaman Bertram Terrell (1893-1912)

Of the ten, only two bodies were identified upon recovery by the Mackey Bennett (These men being Couch and Matherson). Able bodied seaman Lyons, who was heard on the first class boat shouting: “Boat ahoy!” as heard by a fellow able bodied seaman Joseph George Scarrott (1878-1938) in lifeboat number 14. Lyons jumped overboard and attempted to swim to lifeboat number 4, which he successfully reached but sadly he would succumb from the hypothermia.



These are only the identified bodies since there are numerous bodies described as being possibly a seaman (these as body number 20, 24, 40, 78, 106, 160 and 254), however I personally believe this needs to be taken with a grain of salt. If they were indeed all seamen and one does the math it proved that there were more than four bodies recovered of the seamen lost, which could serve as more evidence to support that these men didn’t die below decks despite being quite speculative.
 
Thanks Thomas (most German Thomases I know don't like to be referred to as "Tom" ;)).

But we are not sure if Nichols did take 6 men below like Lightoller said; by 01:05 am, crewmen were getting rather scarce on the port side, particularly Able Seamen. He might have taken only 4 or 5 men and/or it might have included other ranks like firemen, trimmers etc or even the odd steward. Firemen and Trimmers were usually physically strong men and IMO would have been perfectly capable of helping with opening a gangway door. Therefore, it is difficult to guess which men Nichols chose to go down with him. Since he had served on the Olympic, he would have had a good idea of the task ahead and what sort of men could do the job.

I think in this case it is rather difficult to assess by evidence.
 
That order to open gangway doors on a ship starting to list to port (by then) and sinking by the head was a very questionable one and Lightoller himself knew it.
The ship was listing to starboard at the time #6 was being loaded, and during the time that boat #6 was being lowered. They had to push off the boat from the ship's side as it was being lowered. By the way, that also is strong evidence that boat #6 was actually launched before boat #8, but that's another story altogether.
 
By the way, during the questioning 4/O Boxhall, for what its worth:

15473. (The Commissioner.) What did you intend to go back to the ship for? - I intended to go back to try and obey orders that I heard given through the megaphone.
15474. Was that to stand by the gangway door or what? - I do not know whether it was to stand by the gangway door; I do not remember any gangway doors being open.
15475. What were the orders? - Just simply to come round to the starboard side.
 
The ship was listing to starboard at the time #6 was being loaded, and during the time that boat #6 was being lowered. They had to push off the boat from the ship's side as it was being lowered. By the way, that also is strong evidence that boat #6 was actually launched before boat #8, but that's another story altogether.
Well, I was going by Bill Wormstedt's research article on revised Lifeboat launching times.

But if the ship was still noticeably listing to starboard when Lifeboat #6 was lowered, then it could indicate that it was launched earlier than is generally believed. Could be, because 01:10 am seems a little late for Lightoller to lower Lifeboat #6, go to the officer's Quarters to attend the brief "Firearms meeting" and then be back on the port side but further aft where Moody and Lower were loading Lifeboats #16. #14 and #12.

Can it be that Lightoller moved to Lifeboat #6 while Wilde was still supervising loading of Lifeboat #8 and ultimately the two lifeboats were lowered almost together?

but that's another story altogether.
I would very much like to hear that story. Would it be possible to start another thread about it, Sam? I think we can now be sure that it will not be taken on a roundabout trip (well, at least for a while) ;)

15474. Was that to stand by the gangway door or what? - I do not know whether it was to stand by the gangway door; I do not remember any gangway doors being open.
AFAIK, no one in any lifeboat specifically commented about a gangway door being open, but I am willing to be corrected on that.

But specifically with Boxhall's Lifeboat #2, it was lowered at 01:45 am. What would have been the position of the gangway door on the portside E-deck in relation to the ocean level by then? Also the one on D-deck?
 
Would it be possible to start another thread about it, Sam?
Not right now. I'll PM you as to what's going on about the launch sequence. Notice that the current paper does not have words like the LAST or the FINAL revision in it. In fact, it has undergone several revisions since it was first published, and undoubtedly will undergo a few more. It also shows the mark of good research in that the authors are willing to consider other evidence and opinions, and revise if necessary.
 
Lightoller reportedly ordered Nichols to pick 6 men and go down and open the gangway door on E-deck (or was it D-deck? opinions vary) on the port side.
Looking at Lightoller's testimony in the US, he said:
Mr. LIGHTOLLER. Earlier, and before I realized that there was any danger, I told off the boatswain to take some men - I didn't say how many, leaving the man to use his own judgment, to go down below and open the gangway doors in order that some boats could come alongside and be filled to their utmost capacity. He complied with the order, and, so far as I know, went down below, and I did not see him afterwards. That took away a number of men, and we detailed two men for each boat and two men for lowering down.

In The UK he said:
13896. Did you give any orders with the object of getting more people into it when it was in the water? - [Lightoller} Yes, I see what you are alluding to now, the gangway doors. I had already sent the boatswain and 6 men or told the boatswain to go down below and take some men with him and open the gangway doors with the intention of sending the boats to the gangway doors to be filled up. So with those considerations in mind I certainly should not have sent the boats away.

The 6 men were a guess. Notice the follow-up, "or told the boatswain to go down below and take some men with him" which is more in keeping with what he said in America. Also notice that he said doors, plural both times.

Although I posted that Boxhall testified in 1912 that he didn't recall seeing any gangway doors open when he was in the boat (see post #11), 50 years later, in a 1962 BBC broadcast, he said:

"And the captain looked over the side from the bridge and sang out and said, told [sic] me to go ‘round to the Starboard side to the gangway doors, which was practically at the opposite side to where I was lowered. I had great difficulty in getting the boat around there. There was suction. [And] I was using the stroke oar standing up and there was a lady helping, she was steering the boat around the ship’s stern. When I passed ‘round the boat to try and get to this gangway door on the Starboard side her propellers were out of water. I’m not certain if I didn’t pass underneath them. But when I did eventually reach there I found that there was such a mob standing in the gangway doors, really, I daren’t to go alongside because if they’d jumped they’d swamp the boat."

As you know, I'm a bit distrustful of Boxhall for many reasons.
 
But specifically with Boxhall's Lifeboat #2, it was lowered at 01:45 am. What would have been the position of the gangway door on the portside E-deck in relation to the ocean level by then? Also the one on D-deck?
1648317458497.png

The view above does not take into account any listing. It's a centerline view. At 1:45 there was a very noticeable list to port which would have submerged any door on D or E decks forward.
 
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