Gardeners claims

[Bill Wormstedt]

quote:

Qaurtermaster Rowe claimed to see lifeboats in the water before no 7 was lowered.

Not according to what Rowe said in the Inquiry testimony, it wasn't! Rowe said he saw (BI 17615) "should think it was either 13 or 15." And since we know 15 came after 7, there can be no substance to Gardner's claim. Rowe said *nothing* about No. 7.

 

[Randy Bryan Bigham]

"...I can think of a third one..."

I'm curious as well.

 

[Inger Sheil]

Hallo Bill - looks like that notorious difficulty in lifeboat timings has surfaced again, and Gardiner has tired to sow more confusion. Here's what Rowe said at the American inquiry:

quote:

Mr. ROWE. I felt a slight jar and looked at my watch. It was a fine night, and it was then 20 minutes to 12. I looked toward the starboard side of the ship and saw a mass of ice. I then remained on the after bridge to await orders through the telephone. No orders came down, and I remained until 25 minutes after 12, when I saw a boat on the starboard beam.

Senator BURTON. What was the number of the boat?

Mr. ROWE. You could not tell the number. I telephoned to the fore bridge to know if they knew there was a boat lowered. They replied, asking me if I was the third officer. I replied, "No; I am the quartermaster." They told me to bring over detonators, which are used in firing distress signals.

From memory, Gardiner used some convoluted reasoning and timelines, based on when Rowe assisted with the rockets, to try and establish that the boat Rowe saw that prompted his call to the bridge was in the water before the first boats were supposed to have been launched.​

 

[monica e. hall]

Yup, I second Christine here, Inger, where do you get the energy? An example to us all. Re conspiracy theories in general, a great prog on TV here last night - the top conspiracy theories according to website and hits. Sorry, no Gardiner in the top 100, which I guess shows he hasn't made the impression some of us feared. New to me was the No. 1 - microwave mind control. Disturbingly, it has some scientific historical basis, but has gone as far as cellphone masts controlling us all etc. Good stuff! It was only slightly less alarming than the preceding programme ('Horizon', therefore 'refereed') on the failure of the Gulf Stream - now, that really is scary for us here in the UK!

 

[Inger Sheil]

Lol! My younger brother currently favours the 'Reptoid' theory. After a few pints, he will (completely tongue in cheek, lest you worry) begin to tie every conspiracy theory into this one. Whatever you care to nominate, the Reptoids are apparently behind it. No doubt he has too much time on his hands, but - with a cross between morbid fascination and the approach of an academic documenting urban myths - he tracks down new and exotic theories tying these creatures to just about every conspiracy theory out there.

I'm sure they were influencing JP Morgan and Ismay to sink the Olympic!

Lol! I have far too much energy, I've been told - not to mention an implacable determination when I sincerely believe a wrong has been done. The distortion to the historical record would have simply irritated me and I would have acted on that, but there is - as I indicated - also a personal dimension as well to my response.

 

[Lee Gilliland]

Well perhaps as this book is going to create such a commotion, it might well belong to a post on FAQ rather then a long debate about stuff no one has any respect for?

Although I agree Gardiener has it coming.

 

[Inger Sheil]

I have to concur with you btw, Fi - James is taking a somewhat different approach, and as such this thread should stand. Usually I refer people asking questions about the switch to - pre-existing threads, but in this instance a new thread is justified. Gardiner's work deserves to be skewered and mocked, although the thread is now winding down to its natural death. Until someone revives it in a few months time, of course.

 

[Lee Gilliland]

Inger, I could not agree with you more completely. See above post about the hoot of laughter and trash can.

 

[Inger Sheil]

I might mock Gardener's work, but my reaction to his work is mixed with a disdain and contempt that go beyond laughter. Most of it is a poor joke, but there is a current of poison in it that has caused very real harm to at least one good and decent man. I make absolutely no excuses for feeling particularly deeply on this subject.

As I said - he caused great distress to a friend when that friend was dying. And for that reason, I will take every opportunity that presents itself to expose this man's work for the sham it is. Should anyone reading this feel inclined to buy into the rubbish he is peddling - and, judging from responses we've had here in the past, there are quite a few who do - I want them to know exactly what my issues with his work are.

 

[Mike Bull]

I would really, really like to see that man have the guts to sit in a room with some real Titanic buffs, and try and defend himself.

As far as I am concerned, the ******d is taking it for all the money he can get.

 

[Lee Gilliland]

Of course. As are his publishers. Money, not truth, is the name of this game.

 

[monica e. hall]

Take heart, Lee, from the fact (see my post above), that poor old Gardiner didn't even make it into the TV prog "Top 100 Conspiracy Theories", as measured by number of websites and hits. In fact, if you think about it, it's odd that he hasn't boosted his earnings by dedicating a website to his ideas - it's the modern way to spread tosh, after all! I always wonder if he's quietly stalking us by reading these posts.... And I do wonder if he's really in it for the money. Many people would be, I know, but it's entirely possible he does believe what he's writing. I watched a US lady 'alien abductee', aged 63 last night, explaining on TV how she was sure humans weren't clever enough to have developed colour TV and microchips without the assistance of aliens, and she was entirely sincere. The V/O said,
"So, we gave you access to female humans' plumbing, and you gave us Bill Gates. Thanks, guys!" LOL! They're not all locked up ... and neither should they be.

 

[monica e. hall]

Inger,
now I see it all - thanks to your brother (and David Icke). One of the Top 100 conspiracy theories, actually in the Top 10 I think, was the theory that the Brit Royal Family are, in fact, reptoid! Didn't actually see that bit myself (went to make a cup of tea / pour myself another glass - not sure which) but I take my hat off to your brother. You heard it here first!!

 

[Inger Sheil]

Oh, he'll be just delighted by the validation, Monica! I can hear it now "See! See! The Reptoids are behind it all!" I hope it was another glass you were pouring - sounds like a show like that really needs something to accompany it.

I suspect that there's a possibility that Gardener has talked himself into the validity of his own opinions - without knowing him personally, it's difficult to say. From an external viewpoint (and from the odd bits and bobs of information I've been made privy to in off-line conversations) it looks like sheer cynical exploitation, but who knows.

Mike, I'd love to see him challenged to an open, public debate. Face to face, in a room, bringing sources along.

 

[Mike Bull]

Inger-absolutely, hear hear!