Alex Kiehl
Member
This is brilliant! Thanks so much!
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Identifying crew in photos
- Thread starter Paul Burrell
- Start date
Paul Burrell
Member
I enjoyed looking at this. I think you have the IDs spot on. The resolution of the photo is incredible. There is another photo taken from almost the same spot which is labelled as being in Plymouth. Notice the ‘Matchless Pears’ (soap) advertisement sign behind which is also just visible in your photo. This photo has poor resolution and a different set of crew. Do you have other photos too?
Gaston Sam
Member
Yes, there are just a couple changes in the crewmen portrayed in that one.
I don't remember having another one of this particular group, but there are a couple more photos of the victualling crew during those days.
GrahamMearns
Member
Robert John Hopkins: photo taken on his wedding to my Great Aunt Annie Gamble (Nee Graham), in late 1903 in New York. Matches, I believe, figure 20 in the group photograph.
Gaston Sam
Member
20 – AB Robert Hopkins??
So, by process of elimination I just took AB Robert Hopkins (43) into consideration, whose facial features and expression maybe match more than any other, or at least fills the differences that put Vigott out of the list.
Bingo!
Benjamin Carpenter
Member
Hi guys. I’m new to this group so I don’t know if this has been asked before, but can anyone identify the young lads in this footage of some Titanic’s surviving crew? One looks very much like Allen Baggott (highlighted) and can the others be identified? Thank you.
Alex Kiehl
Member
Awesome! Are these actual pictures/footage of rescued crew? If so, they are super cool and do you have any more like them? Wow!
Benjamin Carpenter
Member
Hi Alex,
These are stills from footage of rescued crew on board the Carpathia I believe. There is very few footage like this, so I was hoping these guys could be identified. Just interesting as to why these guys were chosen to be filmed. I’d love to know who these guys are for certain.
Gaston Sam
Member
Well, I have my doubts about those fellows being titanic crew. I've never seen that particular clip Benjamin attached above, but from what I know some shots of that group of young stewards was a fragment of a Gaumont's newsreel, which was entitled "Some of the heroes of the Titanic's crew picked up at sea".
It couldn't be anywhere else other than on board the Carpathia, or they wouldn't have had those lifebelts on.
But then you must remember that those days it would have been difficult to tell of the authenticity of the images displayed at the theatre's news shows, and there was great fascination for images of world events, so they could have literally had any other group of crewmen posing for that shot.
I remember that the complete Titanic newsreel also portrayed QM Sidney Humphreys misidentified as "Hitchens", and also a shot of Captain "Rostrum"!
Anyway, if we assume that this is a real Titanic crew shot, some two or three can be identified without much hesitation and of course with some imagination, namely the third and fourth lads from left to right, being Sidney Daniels (18) and Fred Hartnell (21) respectively. The guy you point out as Baggott is very similar, but there's another shot of this guy with the rest of the group, and paying close attention to him I would tell you he is not Allen Baggott.
It couldn't be anywhere else other than on board the Carpathia, or they wouldn't have had those lifebelts on.
But then you must remember that those days it would have been difficult to tell of the authenticity of the images displayed at the theatre's news shows, and there was great fascination for images of world events, so they could have literally had any other group of crewmen posing for that shot.
I remember that the complete Titanic newsreel also portrayed QM Sidney Humphreys misidentified as "Hitchens", and also a shot of Captain "Rostrum"!
Anyway, if we assume that this is a real Titanic crew shot, some two or three can be identified without much hesitation and of course with some imagination, namely the third and fourth lads from left to right, being Sidney Daniels (18) and Fred Hartnell (21) respectively. The guy you point out as Baggott is very similar, but there's another shot of this guy with the rest of the group, and paying close attention to him I would tell you he is not Allen Baggott.
Benjamin Carpenter
Member
Many thanks for this! These are early days for me in terms of research so your insightful knowledge is fantastic. There is another clip of the same guys shot from another angle, but this shorter clip is in the British Pathé Archives, so I assumed it would have some authenticity.
Of course photography was in its infancy and often grainy so people do look different in various pictures so it’s a case of matching facial features, hairlines etc. It’s a tough task, but if anyone can try and put a name to anyone else in this clip or photos it would be amazing.
Again, thank you for helping in identifying two!
Michael Hinz
Member
Benjamin Carpenter
Member
Hi Michael,
Many, many thanks for this, this has been most helpful. That is some seriously impressive research! I am new to the group and am still very much an amateur in this, but I Thank You again for replying to this thread.
8 and 9 are still mysteries, although I did initially think that 8 was Allen Baggott, as in certain parts of the video he looks slightly different but I now know this isn’t the case.
At least I have some very clear clarification on these guys. You are fantastic!
Ben.
Many, many thanks for this, this has been most helpful. That is some seriously impressive research! I am new to the group and am still very much an amateur in this, but I Thank You again for replying to this thread.
8 and 9 are still mysteries, although I did initially think that 8 was Allen Baggott, as in certain parts of the video he looks slightly different but I now know this isn’t the case.
At least I have some very clear clarification on these guys. You are fantastic!
Ben.
Michael Hinz
Member
Hello Benjamin,
Thank you for your friendly answer. Allen Baggott is a very good guess, even though I think he looks more like 9 (nose and chin).
You can also see 9 and 10 in a picture with 2nd class survivor Sidney Collett.
Michael
Thank you for your friendly answer. Allen Baggott is a very good guess, even though I think he looks more like 9 (nose and chin).
You can also see 9 and 10 in a picture with 2nd class survivor Sidney Collett.
Michael
Benjamin Carpenter
Member
Hi Michael,
This is wonderful. It’s only recently that I’ve really wanted to look at inidentifed crew members, and I have come to the right place!
Would you have any idea as to who 8 and 9 were at all? Would they have been Titanic crew or crew from the Carpathia maybe? It’s seems very difficult to be able to identify 8 - he is the one I’m most intrigued about. In the footage they are filmed from different angles and this guy seems a bit of a character. I’m desperate to know who he is! Maybe we’ll find out sooner or later.
But again, your help has been more than helpful. Thank you!
Ben.
This is wonderful. It’s only recently that I’ve really wanted to look at inidentifed crew members, and I have come to the right place!
Would you have any idea as to who 8 and 9 were at all? Would they have been Titanic crew or crew from the Carpathia maybe? It’s seems very difficult to be able to identify 8 - he is the one I’m most intrigued about. In the footage they are filmed from different angles and this guy seems a bit of a character. I’m desperate to know who he is! Maybe we’ll find out sooner or later.
But again, your help has been more than helpful. Thank you!
Ben.
Michael Hinz
Member
Hello Ben,
I have been always irritated that the crew members in the footage look so cheerful. Frank Terrill even lost a brother in the sinking and still looks overjoyed. This shows once again that some survivors were very traumatized and other were highly unimpressed. In the footage we see many different people and some of them are certainly crew members of the Carpathia or reporters from New York. I marked these 10 people because I am sure that they are Titanic survivors.
8 and 9 wear typical clothes worn by stewards, kitchen hands and cooks on many ships during this time.
9 wears white trousers, a white jacket, black shoes and a White Star Line cap. This outfit was also worn by many crew members in Queenstown.
8 wears dark trousers and a white jacket. He also wears a kind of bandage around his head. I could not find any reports of crew members with such a head injury. Probably he wanted to dramatized his rescue.
There are some members of the victualling crew, of which there are no known photos or body discriptions. 8 seems to be a young man, so I have checked out all the men who might be 8. These men are:
- Frank Herbert Morris (28), Bathroom Steward, saved in lifeboat 14
- Reginald Hardwick (21), Kitchen Porter, saved in lifeboat 13
- George Frederick Crow (26), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 14
- Fred Toms (29), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
- Benjamin James Thomas (30), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
- John Stewart (28), Verandah Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
- Percy Edward Keen (30), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
Percy Edward Keen was a friend of Edenser Edward Wheelton (2). He is known to have been 5' 5' tall (1,65 m) and he had brown hair.
Michael
I have been always irritated that the crew members in the footage look so cheerful. Frank Terrill even lost a brother in the sinking and still looks overjoyed. This shows once again that some survivors were very traumatized and other were highly unimpressed. In the footage we see many different people and some of them are certainly crew members of the Carpathia or reporters from New York. I marked these 10 people because I am sure that they are Titanic survivors.
8 and 9 wear typical clothes worn by stewards, kitchen hands and cooks on many ships during this time.
9 wears white trousers, a white jacket, black shoes and a White Star Line cap. This outfit was also worn by many crew members in Queenstown.
8 wears dark trousers and a white jacket. He also wears a kind of bandage around his head. I could not find any reports of crew members with such a head injury. Probably he wanted to dramatized his rescue.
There are some members of the victualling crew, of which there are no known photos or body discriptions. 8 seems to be a young man, so I have checked out all the men who might be 8. These men are:
- Frank Herbert Morris (28), Bathroom Steward, saved in lifeboat 14
- Reginald Hardwick (21), Kitchen Porter, saved in lifeboat 13
- George Frederick Crow (26), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 14
- Fred Toms (29), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
- Benjamin James Thomas (30), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
- John Stewart (28), Verandah Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
- Percy Edward Keen (30), Saloon Steward, saved in lifeboat 15
Percy Edward Keen was a friend of Edenser Edward Wheelton (2). He is known to have been 5' 5' tall (1,65 m) and he had brown hair.
Michael
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