Amateur radio heard SOS in Welsh town 2,000 miles away

[Gordon Mooneyhan]

For me, the question isn't "what were the rules about MSGs?", it's "to what extent did people like Phillips understand that their role was safety-critical?"

Will

I don't believe many of the Marconi operators believed their job was safety-critical unless they had previously been in an accident.

 

[Mike Spooner]

It doesn't go a miss where G Marconi awarded Harold Bride $1000 for his story. Therefore I can think he was satisfied with his performance.

 

[Arun Vajpey]

I have no evidence to prove it, but if I was Phillips, working under divided loyalties to Captain and Marconi company, I would probably be keen to avoid any situation where I'd have to explain to my land-based boss how I failed to deal with all the revenue-earning traffic because I was tied up helping the ship's Captain with navigational 'stuff'!

IMO, that seems unlikely even of Phillips & Bride did not consider their roles on board as Safety-Critical. If Marconi thought that commercial revenue was more important than the safety of the ship, would they have testified like Gordon pointed out?

At the British inquiry, officials from the Marconi Company (and perhaps even Mr. Marconi himself) said that "ALL navigational messages, regardless of priority, were to be taken to the bridge IMMEDIATELY"

Also, even if wireless ops were not considered safety-critical before, surely Jack Binns' actions on board the Republic would have changed the outlook? I wonder if Marconi modified their regulations after that incident.

From 1910 Marconi Company had been negotiating with the British Government for a contract to create a chain of wireless networks throughout the Empire. Therefore, it would not have been in their interest to crib about delayed commercial traffic due to navigational matters.

 

[Gordon Mooneyhan]

It doesn't go a miss where G Marconi awarded Harold Bride $1000 for his story. Therefore I can think he was satisfied with his performance.

I believe that it was the New York Times that paid Bride for his story. Mr. Marconi was present when Bride told it.

 

[Arun Vajpey]

This is an interesting article, even though most of it relates to a time after the Titanic disaster. The beginnings are relevant, though; if Marconi Company hoped to obtain a major contract with the British Government, they would not have wanted to be seen as being on the wrong side during the Titanic post-disaster investigations.

Imperial Wireless Chain - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mike Spooner]

Has anybody found the Marconi rule book for one operator and for two operators as well?

 

[Wilf]

This is an interesting article, even though most of it relates to a time after the Titanic disaster. The beginnings are relevant, though; if Marconi Company hoped to obtain a major contract with the British Government, they would not have wanted to be seen as being on the wrong side during the Titanic post-disaster investigations.

Indeed, Marconi company would be as interested in controlling the narrative post-disaster as any other of the interested commercial parties were- as you say, they had significant government contracts to win. Incidentally- and totally irrelevant to this thread- I actually lived in the village that formed the base of the first link in the Imperial Wireless Chain!

 

[Steven Christian]

Steven, They weren't even supposed to fix the main set. That was to be left to the techs when they got into port.
My god if that been the case NO ship would of ever come to there rescue. Three cheers for them fixing the wireless.

I agree. I think they did a good job fixing it. But the company rules at the time were that they were not to fix it themselves but wait until it was serviced by a technician. I understand the why the rule was in place. Better to lose a few days revenue than having a someone try to fix it and end up frying the whole set and having to replace it at greater cost.

 

[Steven Christian]

Mike, while I understand where you're coming from here, I don't totally agree with it. We don't know its range since the backup set was never tested. The main radio was supposed to have a 1,000-mile range at night; it hit 3,000 miles (probably a very good night for propagation). Carpathia was believed to be 58 miles away when she got the distress call. Actually, it was probably closer to 45-50 miles since we now know that the Titanic was 13 miles further east than she thought she was. That would have put her within the range of the emergency set.

Yes. Her emergency transmitter was listed as having a daytime range of 40 miles. So at night probably 200 miles or so. Well within the range of the Carpathia.
P.S...something I just learned that I had missed before in many years of reading about this is that besides the battery backup emergency set the main set also had it's own back up oil powered emergency generator. I read that from 2 different sources but am going to check that out further. Don't know how I missed that before. Maybe those senior moments that Arun has referenced kicked in earlier than I thought before. Cheers.

 

[Mike Spooner]

Was it possible to use the emergency transmitter whist repairing the main wireless set?

 

[Steven Christian]

Was it possible to use the emergency transmitter whist repairing the main wireless set?

Yes it was possible. The main set would have been down while repairing it. Sure there was some isolation involved between the 2 sets so one wouldn't backfeed into the other. Thinking of the aerial connections but would have to check on that as I'm not sure about the particulars.

 

[Steven Christian]

IMO, that seems unlikely even of Phillips & Bride did not consider their roles on board as Safety-Critical. If Marconi thought that commercial revenue was more important than the safety of the ship, would they have testified like Gordon pointed out?


Also, even if wireless ops were not considered safety-critical before, surely Jack Binns' actions on board the Republic would have changed the outlook? I wonder if Marconi modified their regulations after that incident.

From 1910 Marconi Company had been negotiating with the British Government for a contract to create a chain of wireless networks throughout the Empire. Therefore, it would not have been in their interest to crib about delayed commercial traffic due to navigational matters.

From the article below:
"It is interesting to note that the Titanic’s Captain, E.J. Smith. requested that Jack Binns sail as Senior Wireless Operator but this was vetoed by the White Star board as a result of his involvement in the ss Republic incident (q.v.), they apparently thought he would bring the Titanic bad luck!"

RMS Titanic – The Radio Officers Association

www.radioofficers.com

P.S...there are a few things in this article I'm not quite sure about but you can read it if interested and decide for yourself. Cheers.

 

[Julian Atkins]

In response to Wilf’s post, I would have thought it clear that the Binns/Republic incident in 1909 made it certain that Marconi had to sell his invention to the steamship companies on the basis of the additional safety it provided. Not for providing tittle tattle commercial passenger traffic.

In any event, the tittle tattle commercial passenger traffic could only be of any consequence once a ship was in range of transmitting to shore.

Hence for much of Titanic’s voyage Phillips and Bride had little to do.

 

[Steven Christian]

From the article below:
"It is interesting to note that the Titanic’s Captain, E.J. Smith. requested that Jack Binns sail as Senior Wireless Operator but this was vetoed by the White Star board as a result of his involvement in the ss Republic incident (q.v.), they apparently thought he would bring the Titanic bad luck!"

RMS Titanic – The Radio Officers Association

www.radioofficers.com

P.S...there are a few things in this article I'm not quite sure about but you can read it if interested and decide for yourself. Cheers.

I did some some follow up and what I found confirms what I read about Jack Binns and Captain Smith. He did request him. He served with him prior on the Adriatic in 1910. But by the time Titanic sailed he had resigned from the Marconi Co.

 

[Julian Atkins]

I very much doubt that Captain Smith would ever have asked for Binns. It was not within his remit, and as Steven says, Binns had already left Marconi. If I may make a suggestion, then it would be that John Durrant of the Mount Temple that could have been on Titanic and done a much better job than either Bride or Phillips did and on his own. Meticulous and attentive. And with a capacity to stay up very late and without any sleep still recording everything.

One ought to think that with the ether buzzing with reports of ice fields and ice bergs all Sunday and previous days the Marconi Operators ought to have been on Rostron’s “Qui Vive”. But apparently not.

I think there was something rotten and wrong with Marconi’s organisation. The USA Inquiry didn’t get to it, and neither did the British Inquiry because the Attorney General was involved in a corrupt Marconi share scandal with his brother.

The British newspapers made Phillips and Bride heroes, albeit Phillips a dead hero. I have always had a big problem with the Titanic Marconi Wireless Operators ignoring MSGs and specific ice warning messages sent to them, and not taking them to the bridge.

I personally think myself (and I know that many of my friends on here and those far more qualified to state an opinion than me and who disagree with me on this point) that Bride and Phillips didn’t do as they should.