Prelude To An Allision - Titanic's Fatal Encounter Revisited

[Mike Spooner]

If Boxhall was relived from the bridge why wasn't Moody brought in to do watch duty work. After all isn't that what a QM is paid to steer the ship as intrusted by an officer to the compass position. Does it really require two of them to check the compass position.

 

[marina_irc]

Don't make excuses for Boxhall not been on the bridge at the time of the iceberg contact. After all that what he is paid for. The only person allowed off the bridge has to be Murdoch. The only reason I can think of is may be Boxhall had diarrhoea problems.

Titanic only had 3 officers on watch at any time, one of them must be able to go do other things to manage the ship properly.

 

[Ian Donaldson]

I think we do the human species an injustice. At night you can actually see further than you can during the day. It is possible to see the flicker of a candle up to 30 miles away. The farthest object visible to the naked eye is the Andromeda Galaxy, an astonishing 2.6 million light-years from Earth!
The important distinction I believe is visual acuity as a function of luminance, which is a different ball game altogether. Hecht and his colleagues established in 1941 that a minimum of 5-14 photons is enough to stimulate a visual response in the human eye. Fleet and Lee did not know how to make the best use of their 'limited' night vision and that night in the crows-nest and there were also other factors in play that reduced the lookout's abilities to distinguish the so-called 'black mass,' before it was too late.

 

[Mike Spooner]

Correct me wrong didn't other shipping companies just have two officers on duty. If that was the case for WSL having three officers on duty was a bonus to them.

 

[Julian Atkins]

I don’t believe Boxhall was needed on the bridge in normal conditions; the problem was that being in the vicinity of ice was treated as “normal”. However even in normal operations it seems like the waste of an officer to have Moody standing there monitoring the Quartermaster. Wasn’t there an automatic rudder angle indicator available for the OOW, or do I misremember?

I am very much in agreement with this post.

But it maybe that White Star regulations required a bridge officer to be beside the quartermaster on the wheel. If that was the case (and I know nothing of White Star regulations) it does seem very odd that on that late evening Boxhall did his ‘rounds’ then went back to his quarters, having spent most of his shift working out star positions that he then mucked up with his CQD position.

As I’ve said on many occasions, Murdoch being alone on the bridge as they approached a known ice field seems utterly ridiculous. Moody was known by Lightoller to consider they would be up to ice by 11pm. Yet he was watching Hichens in the wheelhouse. For what purpose?

Was there some additional concern about Hichens that required this additional surveillance?

The Californian and the Carpathia had the Captain and the watch officer on the bridge.

I do not understand why Murdoch was the only officer on the bridge late that evening. With Boxhall’s ‘rounds’ being inconsequential considering other matters of far greater importance, and Moody standing by Hichens watching his every move - which was nothing.

All seems a bit bonkers to me.

 

[Samuel Halpern]

Humour me! If Murdoch had not been alone on the bridge and the potentially unwell Boxhall had been next to Hichens instead of Moody, and Moody been on the bridge with Murdoch then Murdoch could have called out to Moody to ring down ‘stand by’ on the engine room telegraph?

Too late. The OOW is not going to put engine room on standby every time lookout bells are rung. If they would have thought that the engine room needed to be on standby the time to do that was the time they expected to encounter ice, not when ice is first sighted. The leading watch section engineers, the 2nd engineer and the assistant 2nd engineer, were busy inspecting the boiler rooms as required by IMM rules before the end of the watch. They obviously started with BR6 and worked back to BR2 (BR1 was not lit.) They were not drinking tea. Anyway, to avoid objects in your path, the best way was to have full maneuverability available for your vessel, which means a full head of steam and quick action at the helm.

 

[Samuel Halpern]

it maybe that White Star regulations required a bridge officer to be beside the quartermaster on the wheel

Nothing in the rule book about that. The J/Os were there to do whatever the OOW desired of them. They may have thought that it was better to have one station in the wheelhouse where the phones were located and keeping an eye on the QM at the wheel to make sure he wasn't drifting off.

 

[Samuel Halpern]

The only person allowed off the bridge has to be Murdoch.

Absolutely not. The OOW was required to be on the bridge all watch long. The J/Os would come and go as needed to perform whatever functions they were told to do.

 

[Julian Atkins]

Hi Sam,

That is very interesting that Moody didn’t have to be besides Quartermaster Hichens at the wheel.

So Moody could have been tasked with keeping watch with Murdoch?

 

[Arun Vajpey]

If they would have thought that the engine room needed to be on standby the time to do that was the time they expected to encounter ice, not when ice is first sighted.

Precisely. IMO, if Captain Smith had considered the ice field ahead in the Titanic's path based on the reports that he knew about, the time to put the Engine Room crew on standby would have been when he had that conversation with Lightoller around 9pm before retiring to his cabin.

So Moody could have been tasked with keeping watch with Murdoch?

I think Sam meant that Moody, as the J/O, was expected to follow OOW Murdoch's orders. If Murdoch wanted an additional pair of eyes with him on the bridge, I expect he would have ordered Moody to do so.

They may have thought that it was better to have one station in the wheelhouse where the phones were located and keeping an eye on the QM at the wheel to make sure he wasn't drifting off.

Probably, but in that case would it not have been overkill to have Boxhall also on the bridge? If Murdoch had decided that Moody should be on watch with him on the bridge, it is possible that he would have at the same time ordered Boxhall to take over what Moody was doing. As it was, I think Boxhall was on stand-by duty and so was not required to be physically on the bridge all the time unless specifically ordered by the OOW to be there.

 

[marina_irc]

Precisely. IMO, if Captain Smith had considered the ice field ahead in the Titanic's path based on the reports that he knew about, the time to put the Engine Room crew on standby would have been when he had that conversation with Lightoller around 9pm before retiring to his cabin.


I think Sam meant that Moody, as the J/O, was expected to follow OOW Murdoch's orders. If Murdoch wanted an additional pair of eyes with him on the bridge, I expect he would have ordered Moody to do so.


Probably, but in that case would it not have been overkill to have Boxhall also on the bridge? If Murdoch had decided that Moody should be on watch with him on the bridge, it is possible that he would have at the same time ordered Boxhall to take over what Moody was doing. As it was, I think Boxhall was on stand-by duty and so was not required to be physically on the bridge all the time unless specifically ordered by the OOW to be there.

My thought is that having Boxhall on the bridge gains you at most five seconds in getting the orders down to the engine room, and a third pair of lookout eyes; and if you thought you needed a third pair of lookout eyes and five seconds would mean life or death for your ship then why aren’t more lookouts posted on the forepeak and why aren’t you slowing down.

Once you frame the decisionmaking through the lens of “this is not a dangerous situation” which all the North Atlantic liner companies had around ice, all the pieces of why people did the things they did fall into place. Boxhall wasn’t on the bridge because there was no risk. They didn’t slow down because there was no risk. They didn’t post extra lookouts because there was no risk. Clear visibility == No risk of hitting ice.

They thought that, and they made their decisions on that basis, and that’s why there’s nothing suspicious in their decisionmaking.

 

[Arun Vajpey]

My thought is that having Boxhall on the bridge gains you at most five seconds in getting the orders down to the engine room, and a third pair of lookout eyes; and if you thought you needed a third pair of lookout eyes and five seconds would mean life or death for your ship then why aren’t more lookouts posted on the forepeak and why aren’t you slowing down.

I don't agree. Even if Boxhall had been present on the bridge, there is no guarantee that he would have seen anything earlier than the lookouts or Murdoch. In any case, it was the lookouts job to ring the bells when they thought that they saw something in the ship's forward path, which is what they did. From that moment on, it was the OOW who would have used first his eyes and then binoculars to see the iceberg, assess his options and make the decision about the actions to take. In other words, it was totally Murdoch's call and neither Moody nor Boxhall could have taken any action independent of the First Officer.

Furthermore, we cannot be sure that on that particular night an additional pair of eyes would have made any difference. One of Sam's earlier posts tells how Fleet later admitted that after he thought that he saw something on the horizon, he asked Lee about it but the latter could see nothing. It was only then that Fleet rang the bell in the Crow's Nest, which IMO indicates a time lag of 25 to 30 seconds before Fleet's very first impression and the first of the 3 bells. If Fleet had to check with Lee that there was indeed something ahead in the ship's path, then he, Fleet himself, would have spent about 10 seconds staring at the perceived "something" before asking Lee; then for Lee to say that he could not see anything, he must have followed the direction of Fleet's gaze for at least another 10 seconds before answering.

I do not believe that any of them - Murdoch, Fleet, Lee, Moody or Boxhall could have done better given that neither the course nor the speed of the ship had been changed by the Captain earlier. The ship's speed, the darkness and hence the limited visual acuity meant that the combined factors involved were beyond human ability to avoid the outcome. In other words, it was already too late when the first bell was struck.

 

[Mike Spooner]

Nothing in the rule book about that. The J/Os were there to do whatever the OOW desired of them. They may have thought that it was better to have one station in the wheelhouse where the phones were located and keeping an eye on the QM at the wheel to make sure he wasn't drifting off.

Was there or not a standby QM on hand.

 

[Mike Spooner]

If Boxhall or Moody where Murdoch was on the wing of the bridge and Murdoch at the centre point of the bridge surely valuable seconds could been saved by giving out orders early. I don't buy it the centre mast would restrict your vision ahead as anybody with common sense would stand to one side of the mast.

 

[Mike Spooner]

We heard from the inquiry Lightoller estimated the ice region was about 9.30 on and Junior officers 11.00 on. So what time did Murdoch estimate for the ice region? Correct me wrong I have a feeling Murdoch and Smith never ask there officers for their estimated time.